So here’s the online chat Steph and I had about some of our favorite TV shows. During this discussion, we cover story arcs, characters–particularly the anti-hero, and a crapload of spoilers for the following shows: Castle, Downton Abbey, Game of Thrones, NCIS, Once Upon a Time, The Originals, Person of Interest, Psych, Revenge, and The Vampire Diaries. So… don’t read too far in if you don’t want to know some of what’s happened!
Also, we admit this is a pretty long blog post, so Steph and I split it into two parts. Read the first part below, and head over to the Vindicator Artists blog to get the rest of it!
Stephanie is in blue. I’m in red.
So I know that we had talked about doing this last week, but you had an exciting shoot to do!
Which was great for me, too, since it gave me a chance to do some last minute catch-up on some of the shows I’ve slacked on.
Yeah, it was a great shoot. Really excited about it. Martial arts film. Woo-hoo! It was great to be back on set with my film family. I’ve really missed it. I love writing and enjoy my solitude, but I’m always glad to be back on set. I really miss it when I don’t get to be on set.
That is exciting. I’m extremely jealous.
Yeah, it’s really hard, when you first get out of film school, where you were so busy with more projects and schoolwork than you could handle, and then you graduate and your classmates that you’ve been making movies with for the past three years scatter all over the country, and everyone is trying to make ends meet and still do what we love which is telling stories on screen.
Matching up content with funding is ridiculously hard. Especially in an economic environment in which nobody is really excited to invest in anything.
True. Wow, yes we could even spend a whole blog about that topic and Kickstarter, Zach Braff, Spike Lee, and Veronica Mars and what it means for indie filmmakers like us. And maybe we’ll do that, too! But this evening we’re going to focus on television–a topic which as you know, Steph, is near and dear to my heart. Much more, in fact, than feature filmmaking.
Did you ever see Veronica Mars when it was on TV?
I saw an advertisement at Walmart and got it confused with Veronica Roth, the author of Divergent series.
That was my bad.
Huh. Yeah. No. Totally different… everything. I’ll spare you my opinion of Veronica Roth and her trilogy, though.
That’s what I get for staying too much in my writer’s solitude. I have no idea with what’s going on with the rest of the world that I’m supposed to be writing about.
We need to boost your television literacy!
I know. It’s embarrassing.
But it’s funny, since when you and I first talked about doing this dual blog thing, we discussed what shows we watched.
About how many shows did you say you watch? Religiously?
I watch about eleven throughout the year. Some of them have short seasons.
And I spend time catching up on some shows on Netflix.
For example, I just finished Dr. Who episodes that are available on Netflix. Picked up the first season of Fringe and working on fourth season of Sons of Anarchy.
And a couple of episodes of Into the Universe with Steven Hawking.
Ahh. So you like a little education with your entertainment.
It makes me feel better for the hours I spend, haha.
Well, I remember I started listing off the shows that I watch, and then we discovered that I may watch a lot of TV. Maybe more than is healthy for a sane human being.
At the close of this spring season and as we head into summer, I watch about forty-eight shows, of which thirty-seven will be continuing sometime next fall, winter, or spring.
And it never really seemed like a lot to me, but apparently I’m a couch potato/TV junkie.
Let’s be clear, though. I don’t have a problem. 🙂
I just think there’s a ton of great content out there now. In fact, I daresay that television is the place to be if you want to write, create, produce, or even act really compelling stuff.
Exactly. I mean, I’m not diminishing film at all. I still enjoy the big summer spectacle and the Oscar darling. What I mean is that TV was once considered a stepping stone toward a film career, but I’d say it’s really become part of the cultural consciousness just as much as features, maybe even more. You’ve got Game of Thrones, The Walking Dead, Mad Men, Downton Abbey, True Detective.
Yeah, I still love movies, but I think in television you have a greater opportunity to develop long character arcs and develop more subplots and have more of an ensemble of compelling characters than even franchise films where you only get the audience for two hours a year or every other year.
It seems like communities are built around TV shows more so than films that have a few weeks in the theater, and then in a few months they are out on DVD and there are so many choices on Redbox and Netflix that it’s hard for a film that doesn’t have a community behind it to compete with the other content.
I think Marvel is trying to fix that for themselves, but they are having to spend so much money to pull it off and so much depends on the audience keeping interest in superheroes.
That said, I would be heartbroken if I didn’t get to go to the movies.
I might feel that way, too, if I hadn’t spent almost two years working at a movie theater. That almost killed my love for films. But you’re definitely onto something, pointing out TV’s ability to do longer story arcs, to really build and deconstruct fascinating characters. I feel like this TV season has been especially brutal, though, to some of our favorite characters. What do you think about that?
Brutal, downright cruel. I understand the need to up the ante to maintain audience interest, but I don’t know. I think some of the shows have pulled out too many stops.
At this point, I’d like to warn the readers that we will be diving into some of the specifics of this past season’s TV shows.
So… SPOILERS AHEAD! You’ve been warned.
I know that you watch more than a few shows I haven’t really gotten into, Steph. Any particularly painful moments you’d like to share/relive? 🙂
I have been dying to talk to someone about The Vampire Diaries!!
I have to emphasize the word dying.
Alright. I’ll be honest. I have not been keeping up with that show this season. But I did read some articles a couple days ago and essentially spoiled myself. Go ahead.
Depending on whether or not Damon is actually dead or not, I am either really excited to see how they are going to bring him back or I am ready to burn down the studio which is in Georgia, so not too far from my clutches.
Don’t get me wrong. I like most of the characters but there is no way Enzo can replace Damon.
You little pyro. So are you saying you didn’t see this coming?
I had heard that Damon dies in one of the books, but I never dreamed they would write him off, so I’m assuming there is a way to bring him back from the “dead” or “undead dead.”
I don’t think the show would survive without Damon.
If they were wanting me to totally believe that Damon was really dead, I don’t believe it.
It seems to be the curse of the onscreen/offscreen romance. But you seem to think they didn’t actually kill him… permanently. Which is already weird to say, since he plays a vampire on the show.
Well, they’ve been building toward Damon accepting the ultimate act of heroism which is to die to save everyone else, but he was acting under the belief that Bonnie could bring him back. So I knew that when he went to the Other Side, I had a feeling that he wasn’t going to make it back.
Also, it seems nobody on TVD ever really stays dead.
I know. So I don’t know how they could really make Damon and Bonnie and Lexi stay dead forever.
Especially now that Alaric is back. Damon is his drinking buddy. So of course Damon is coming back.
Now, I did watch TVD from the beginning up until about halfway through this season. In some ways, he’s really developed a lot as a character. Four+ years, and I guess a character should show growth, or they start to get a little boring, right?
Damon has come a long way.
Stefan even makes the comment when Damon dies that Damon had just gotten everything he wanted and he was happy.
So I guess the moral is as soon as you get everything you want, you die.
Misery is the secret to life, is that it?
I guess you can’t be accepted into whatever the other side of the Other Side is if you still have unhappiness holding you back. The other side of the Other Side can’t be contaminated with the tragedy of human experience.
Bottom line: if the studio has made Damon dead to me, then TVD is dead to me.
Amen and Amen. I agree, Damon is the lifeblood (har-har) of that show.
Now, this isn’t the first show that’s tried to pull a death-that-is-not-death on you, is it? I heard something similar about Castle…?
Well, the network kind of spoiled that one when they went to commercial break and said Kate and Castle will return next season, so obviously he’s not really dead. And pretty much the only way to kill a main character is to show the body with the eyes open in the death stare. Even then, I still held out hope that Matthew Grantham could possibly still be alive.
Matthew, no. Ugh. Why’d you take me there? The pain is still too near.
Damn you, Downton Abbey!
But, and I feel bad about this, but a new romance for Mary sounds fun.
True, but in a way I feel like maybe they should’ve retitled the show this season to The Many Men of Mary. But Matthew’s death was last season, not this season. Not a single death for the Granthams this year (which is the UK’s last year, but whatever), proving that TV is not all doom and gloom after all.
At least Psych ended on a somewhat good note. Jules’s engagement ring got stolen just as Shawn finally proposed, but that led into a fun car chase.
Shawn and Gus are still together.
To be fair, though, Psych never really went to much of a dark place, did it? I don’t know. I didn’t catch the last season and a half.
Yeah, it never got too serious. A couple years ago, we thought Henry may have died, but he survived.
Shawn and Gus almost die every episode, but we always know they will get of it by some bizarre occurrence in the universe.
Or Shawn’s smart mouth.
Well, clearly they couldn’t kill Henry (Shawn’s dad). It would’ve irrevocably changed the characters of the show.
Yeah, the show is more about how unchangeable the characters are.
It’s one of the key differences between Psych and The Mentalist.
I mean, that and the fact that Psych is pure awesome, and The Mentalist is obnoxious and should be put out to pasture. 🙂
(Okay, that’s not fair of me. I’ve never watched a whole episode.)
Haha. well, some people like the show even if they think Jane is a jerk.
Jane is good and highly entertaining as a jerk, so it works for him.
He fits well with the rest of the characters, kinda like Gibbs on NCIS. Gibbs is a jerk sometimes but you can always depend on DiNozzo to lighten the mood.
Yes, and like Jane, DiNozzo is also obnoxious–but in a much more lovable way.
So what we’re really saying is Jane is a combination of Gibbs and DiNozzo…
Hmmm. I guess you could make that suggestion.
I love DiNozzo, so I’m very protective of him, haha.
Okay, now I haven’t watched this show much since the fourth season. Did I miss anything? 🙂 I didn’t, right?
Well, Ziva isn’t there, but I don’t remember which season she came in. Pretty much the characters are the same. DiNozzo has matured at infinitesimal increments, and he has had some serious moments.
What season is it in, anyway?
11, I think.
But the success is not because of the change in the characters or the storylines. It’s because we can depend on the NCIS team to be the same every week. We know what to expect. They never let us down by changing into someone else. I would be devastated if Tony DiNozzo got all serious and stopped being an overgrown frat boy.
Funny you mention that. Now if I remember right, NCIS got in pretty much at the beginning of the forensic drama craze, didn’t it?
Yes, I think so.
One thing that helped the show was that it was in the same universe as JAG, which was a popular courtroom drama that had similar who-dun-it aspects to it and a good ensemble of characters.
In fact, if I may add, I have been waiting for years, for NCIS to have Harm and Mac make a guest appearance, haha.
Hm. I never watched JAG, except for the backdoor pilot that introduced Gibbs. Long time ago. And like I said, I gave up on NCIS years ago, mostly I guess because I sorta lost interest in the procedural thing. But maybe you can speak to that. What do you think separates NCIS from other shows with a similar premise, like CSI, Criminal Minds, and Law & Order?
go to Vindicator Artists to read the rest!